Unpacking Truths
Dive deep into God's word and unpack divine truths for today's life journey. In a world where everyone is seeking, join us as we guide you to find hope and power in God's timeless wisdom. If our discussions spark questions or ideas, reach out to us at UnpackingTruths@LOCChurch.com. Don't forget to Like, Share, and Subscribe, allowing us to continue helping people unpack God's truth for their lives! Hosted by Pastor Kendall Koenig and Pastor Maureen O'Connor of Light of Christ Church in Algonquin, IL.
Unpacking Truths
How to Experience God Personally
Ever wondered how moments of weakness can transform into profound experiences of God's presence? Discover Pastor Mo’s heartfelt journey through a painful breakup, where he battled the urge to respond with anger but ultimately found peace through scripture and obedience. Pastor Kendall joins in to reflect on how our lowest points make us more open to divine guidance, emphasizing the power of aligning ourselves with God's will to truly feel His closeness.
We also explore the role of spiritual disciplines in everyday life, from worship and prayer to engaging with Christian literature. Hear a moving story from a mission trip that underscores the importance of being present and attentive to God's work. Delve into Richard Foster's detailed disciplines, both inward and outward, and learn how community and fellowship can elevate your spiritual growth. This episode calls for a deeper openness, vulnerability, and expectancy in our daily routines to experience God more fully and encourages sharing personal spiritual practices with others.
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Hello listeners and welcome back to another episode of Unpacking Truths. We're excited to again be responding to a question that one of you submitted, and it's a great question how do you experience God personally? I'm Pastor Kendall and I'm Pastor.
Speaker 2:Mo.
Speaker 1:Welcome to Unpacking Truths, where we dive deep into God's timeless truths for our lives today.
Speaker 2:Grab your coffee, open your hearts and your minds, come take this journey with us as we unpack God's timeless truths for our lives today.
Speaker 2:Grab your coffee, open your hearts and your minds, come, take this journey with us as we unpack God's truths. Yeah, so when we think about how we experience God, I can only talk and speak into this from my own context. Right, okay, and so one of the biggest ways that I have found where I've connected to God or felt the very presence of God has been really in God's word, because there have been distinct times in my life where I wasn't sure what to do, I wasn't sure what to say, and different scripture would come up, and so that was God's spirit really guiding me, and I felt that, and many times I just actually had this experience where a relationship had ended it didn't end great and I was really seeking God. I needed to feel the very presence of God in this, presence of God in this, and I was hoping God, you know, allowed me to maybe like smite him or you know, you know curses on you or something.
Speaker 1:But as I find a verse for that you know I was.
Speaker 2:I was looking, I was like, come on, god, you know what, what are you going to do? Wrath down fire on him, you know. And as I was praying, I felt God and what came up was the scripture regarding loving your neighbor over and over. And I was like, ew, no thanks.
Speaker 2:Next, yeah, I was like next, and I just kept hearing in my heart tell him my truth, just how loved he is, and I thought this has got to be the worst thing God has asked me to do. I wanted to go throat punch him personally, but apparently God wanted me to speak truth into how loved he was. Right, because hurt people hurt people. And so, you know, obviously there was some insecurities, some things going on within him where he didn't feel loved. And so I found myself as I continued to pray and wrestle with this and didn't want to do that.
Speaker 2:Then what came into my heart was a scripture where Jesus was saying if you have anything against your brother, leave the temple, get out of worship, go and make things right before you come back in the house of God.
Speaker 2:And that then to me was God saying how can you live into who I've called you to be as a pastor and leading worship when you're not even listening to the love that I've called you to be in the world. And so, instead of doing what I had otherwise wanted to do, I ended up going and giving this person that had actually hurt me pretty bad a Bible and highlighted verses speaking into how loved he was, just for who he was, not because of what he's done or accomplished, not because of what he's done or accomplished. And I was faithful in that. And I would never have gotten to that conclusion of experiencing God and hearing from God had I not already known some of the scriptures. So that is exactly how God guided me, was through his word and does it all the time I'll hear. Be quick to listen and slow to speak right when I'm talking with my mom or someone else who can I don't know, kind of trigger me get me, you know, trigger me, get me from one to 15 really quickly.
Speaker 2:God's Word just comes and speaks into my heart and my mind, and it's through Scripture. It really is moving and breathing.
Speaker 1:You know, one of the things that strikes me out of that story and sort of almost series of stories, mo is sometimes I think we can experience God most clearly or most powerfully when we're at our weakest when we're hurting when we're realizing we've sort of come to the end of our own strength, that sometimes that makes us more moldable, more ready to listen even though you really didn't want to listen to what you had to hear.
Speaker 1:God had to say. But I do think sometimes in our brokenness we can experience God in ways that when we're strong and going forward we are like, yeah, I'd like a little God on the side, but it is in our. You know, paul keeps saying in my weakness I am strong. You know where God says my grace is sufficient that sometimes we experience God's grace in our weakest, or we experience God's guidance most clearly when we're most wanting to go this way. God sends us the other way.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and you know what. But the beauty of it was that after I had done that right Like after I had been faithful to that and dropped this off and had a beautiful note with it as well I felt the peace of God right, that past understanding, I felt at peace. Finally, I felt good. I'm still dealing with hurt, but at the same time I felt just a sense of peace instead of anxiety that I was feeling prior and that was me experiencing God and some of those promises.
Speaker 1:Well and there's another interesting point in that, mo that some of that peace comes out of obedience.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 1:That when we are obedient to God and to what he is calling us to, even if it's surprising things and hard things, there is a peace that comes because we know we're standing in God's will.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:You know sometimes. You know what's the old joke about. You know if you're not, what's the old joke about. You know if you don't sense God close. Who moved. Oh right, you know we sometimes think God moved away from us. Well, maybe it's. We've moved away from God because we're acting in our own will, doing our own thing. When we are obedient, we will sense God closer because we have started to align ourselves with what God is saying to us?
Speaker 2:Yes, and I do believe that it's like so. Scripture says that God is always with us, never leaves us, is before us, is behind us, is beside us. But I think you're very right. I think something happens when we're obedient and we don't listen to our feelings, but instead follow what God has called us to do and how God's called us to live, and we open ourselves up to being able to experience God so much more um in our lives. So I think that, yeah, I agree with you there, definitely.
Speaker 1:Um, well, and I love this, we, we always talk a little bit ahead. Uh, listeners, you know with where this is going, but then things come up.
Speaker 1:We didn't talk about that piece that God just took us there. So let me just share a couple of the places where I've experienced God personally in my life as well. For me, as a kid growing up and in my grade school and high school and even college years and beyond, it wasn't worship, it was in times of worship, through the preaching, that I would sometimes. I did this thing as a kid and I don't know that I did it, but we had a pastor who I grew up, who was my pastor, was a good preacher, a good communicator, and I remember as a kid sitting in the pew and just really zeroing in and really hearing from him what felt like God speaking into my life and in ways that, like the rest of the everything faded and I was just focused in on that moment, and so I experienced God through the words that you know, pastor Luking, pastor.
Speaker 2:Dean.
Speaker 1:Luking great work man, shout out, shout out Appreciated it and it really sensed he was trying to bring God's word and speak it into my life. So in preaching on retreats some high school retreats, but also our E3 retreat here have been moments where I've experienced God speaking truth into my life.
Speaker 2:And what do you think it is about those retreats, though?
Speaker 1:Oh, I think you know it's the classic. You know we're often so frazzled in our busy world.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And there is something and I say it to folks who go on the E3 retreat you give God 48 hours of undivided attention. It's not that God needs the attention, Right, it's that we're putting the other stuff to the side and so we're actually in a place where we can listen.
Speaker 2:Absolutely Well. Leviticus 10 speaks into God saying I must be glorified. And so we are to craft our lives in a way where we give God our first right, Our time, our attention. You know we so often, I think, forget to invite God. God's there, right, but I want to invite you into my day, I want you with me. When we're in relationships we want to know our partner wants to be with us, or our friends, the people we're with, and God wants that as well. Right, Like, come into my day, into my morning, everything I do.
Speaker 1:Well and Mo. I think that's a perfect segue into part of what I wanted to lift up today. For experiencing God personally. One of the things that I was reminded of I don't know 20-some years ago is there was this whole movement of reclaiming spiritual disciplines by people like Richard J Foster and Dallas Willard, with the spirit of the disciplines acknowledging that there are disciplines in our lives, disciplines of worship, of devotional time, of reading scripture, of prayer, of meditation, but also other sorts of disciplines that help us that when we practice them as habits and habits sound like bad things, but practical disciplines we're opening ourselves up to looking for God, we're opening ourselves to hearing and sensing God rather than just running through our day and Not in just missing the moments where God shows up.
Speaker 2:What are some disciplines that you have applied to your life, that where you have experienced God?
Speaker 1:You know, one of the and this may sound like the simplest, foolish, most foolish little thing, but for me one of the most constant disciplines, probably the two most constant disciplines of my life, are one, worship, but secondly, prayer before meals disciplines probably the two most constant disciplines of my life are one, worship, but secondly, prayer before meals. And for me those aren't perfunctory moments. Those are moments where I actually am stopping in the middle of my day, whether I'm with a group of people or I'm by myself, and I just am thanking God for this moment, for this day, and it's just a moment where I'm pausing and just sort of going thank you and I'm open to you, lord. And so those are a couple of the disciplines. I mean there are others that I use as well, taking some time in devotional, in prayer, in the moment, in various moments, but those have been probably two of the most constant in my life.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, I found just coming off of this. I just came off of a mission trip. For those who don't know, it was an Appalachia service project. We're in Virginia and we were helping work on homes. And that's proof that God's spirit works in and through us, because I was up there helping replace a roof with a team of women and you know we can do all things through Christ, who gives us strength and we did a great job. But I, you know, I really experienced the presence of God when we got to talk to the homeowner.
Speaker 2:She was in her forties, she is in her 40s, she has a debilitating disease where she's in a wheelchair now and it's an electric wheelchair and she would wheel out every morning and just sit there in the hot sun and be with us and she was just so filled with joy to be with us and she would share her life and about her daughter and different struggles she's had, but always circling back to just how grateful she is and how.
Speaker 2:How can you not believe in a God? Look at you, beautiful women on my roof, um, helping helping my home, um, so that it no longer leaks. And like the roof no longer is leaking, and I was just like my mind was just. I just felt God like saying to me do you see me? Like do we take the time to see God in all things? Like she could have been upset I'm in this wheelchair, you ladies are taking forever on my roof like all this different stuff. She could have looked at it so many different ways, but she had a godly perspective and and it's because she herself every morning she spent time with God and it really helped structure her day. But in our encounter with her we just felt God at work, in the way our stories would connect and we were able to relate in different ways and share wisdom and how God worked in our life, through relationships or our children or all that stuff.
Speaker 1:Well, and that's where I think, experiencing God personally, some of it is putting those. You could miss those moments if you aren't tuned into those moments.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. The present moment is key because we could have easily been distracted and we were at times right, right up on that roof Like I got to get this done. I don't have time to come down there. You know, I'm going to work through my break or lunch, when it was like God so often calls us to, so much more. If we would just lift our heads up from our cell phones or stop and and ask God what do you want me to do right in this moment? Right, not my agenda, not my task list, but what are you calling me to do? And that's where we experience God, when we're open to that and we surrender to that in our everyday lives.
Speaker 1:And that, to me, is what the disciplines do, is they begin to shape us to be people who are open, listening, looking for the ways that God is wanting to be present, expecting, expecting, expecting God to move and work. You know one of the other things that you know. When I was reflecting on this question over the last week, remember that one of the things in my teenage and 20s teenage years and 20s one of the things that shaped where I experienced God's touch and presence was also through Christian literature of reading.
Speaker 1:And the reading authors like CS Lewis, Walt Wangeren, Frederick Buechner. There was just that they imbued their writings, their narratives, with God moments and grace moments in ways that in seeing it written or seeing it in someone else's story, I then was looking for it in my own story.
Speaker 2:It's Jesus, it's parables, it's storytelling. We know who we are through story, we know who we're called to be through story, we know what God is doing through story and it's so powerful, and I think that's why sharing our stories, too, is an incredible way to experience God. But we have to be open and vulnerable enough and trust God enough to share our stories.
Speaker 1:And Absolutely, absolutely. You know, it also strikes me, mo, as we're talking about this and the reason this person probably sent in this question, is because they're maybe struggling to experience God personally, and I think it's important for us to acknowledge it's not that, you know, because Mo and I are pastors, we experience God moments every day, all day.
Speaker 2:I'm on the mountaintop every single day.
Speaker 1:It isn't like that. Sarcasm and I think we've talked about this in an earlier podcast, but, mother Teresa, when they discovered some of her writings after her death how much she struggled to experience a sense of Christ's presence in her life.
Speaker 2:Wasn't it? It was like over 10 years.
Speaker 1:It was an extended period of time.
Speaker 2:She didn't feel the presence of God and yet every day she got up and did nothing but serve the community of Kolkata, India, in incredible ways that transformed that culture over there.
Speaker 1:And so I think it is a reminder that it's not that we've experienced God Jesus warm and fuzzies every moment of every day. We don't that. We do disciplines. We adopt different disciplines in our lives to keep us ready and keep us looking for, but we also do those to just keep on walking the path, whether we're feeling it or not.
Speaker 2:Well, and that's a big thing. I think you just said it there. I think so often we affiliate the way we feel with God being present, and it's not about the way we feel. Are our eyes opened to see what God is doing? Because we can use our brain, our logic to go, wow, look at how God is moving right now. I don't need to feel all euphoric inside and that's how I think we're called to see the world and be. It's not about just, yeah, feeling some sense of God.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think there are times when we can. Yeah, absolutely, and there are moments, but it isn't that we live on a mountaintop all the time.
Speaker 2:Well, and I think, because we're all created so different, it's important to kind of think about who we are and what helps us be in the present moment the most, Because that's where I've often experienced God is when I can be fully present. And so for some, I know it's when they're riding their motorcycle, right, I mean they have to be present and they feel the very presence of God, kind of in the rush of trusting God right as they're going the speed limit, of course, always down the highway.
Speaker 1:Or just under.
Speaker 2:Or just yeah, or just under, and they feel free, right, and then they reflect on I know a buddy of mine was telling me I reflect on the freedom that God gives us when I'm riding and what does that mean? The way I feel the wind, the way I feel so free, with nothing around me, that is the freedom I'm to be living into, and that abundant life that God's promised. And so what does that look like in my life, in all parts of my life, to live out that sense of freedom? Yeah, yeah, not fear.
Speaker 1:You know, I want to just go back to again naming some of these disciplines.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Because I think there are, and one of the things that I love about both of these books is it doesn't say you have to do A, b, c, d and then you automatically get experiences of God Step by step. We're different people and then you automatically get experiences of God Step by step. That we're different people and so there are different things that will resonate. But from Richard Foster's book, he talks about the inward disciplines of meditation, of prayer, of fasting and study, but then he talks about outward disciplines of simplicity, of solitude, of submission, of service what you were talking about on the ASP but then also corporate disciplines of confession and worship, of guidance and celebration, that we can experience God also in the times of wondrous joy.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I like the celebration one, so could we have far more parties here and do some fun celebrating during staff meetings. I'm going to need that list of spiritual disciplines over there and I will apply them, find ways to apply them to the mundane in life.
Speaker 1:You know, one of the other ones that they name here is fellowship, which you know is the churchy word. That means friendship. But there is a sense that another discipline is putting ourselves in community.
Speaker 2:Absolutely.
Speaker 1:Because I think there can be times where this past week a woman came to worship and I just happened to be up in the front as she walked in with her husband and we just shared a hug right there and the hug lingered because she's been facing some hard stuff in her life and she emailed me later and said, wow, that just meant so much to just have that extra sense of someone else's presence in connection, in the middle of that. And so I think sometimes we can be to one another a symbol, a sign and the very realness of God's presence in someone's life.
Speaker 2:Absolutely Not even doing anything, but just being present with someone during some of the most difficult times of their life helps them to experience God. I know that was a big part for me when my brothers both passed away just having friends sit with me, right, we didn't even need to talk. There's one thing I have to share, though, because this has been something that I've newly discovered in my own journey with God, and really experiencing God is confession, and confession with God, right, and so, um, you know, when I look at my life and I reflect on how I'm living, right, I'm like, okay, if I'm honest with myself, I don't really trust you with my money, because I feel the need to do a, b and C. Or I don't really trust you Even with I'm single. Right, like finding relationships. Right, like finding yoking myself with somebody. Like God, thanks, but I got this right, so I'll give it to God and then I'll take it back, and so I need to sit down and go.
Speaker 2:Where am I not trusting you? You know what, god? I don't trust that you will provide for me and that you are a God of abundance. I don't trust that you will protect me, and so I have to find yoke myself to someone else who will protect me, because otherwise I'm finding myself naturally and unconsciously striving to meet my own needs, and we so easily fall into that when we forget. And so I begin with confession because, like any relationship, god wants us to keep it real. And by doing that, I think, then I created this space where I'm able to hear God so much more beautifully and feel God in my life and see things that I need to change and be more faithful with and take that leap of faith out there and let God do what God does right, like rock our world and help us see just how amazing God is when we live into that. And so I think a big part, yeah, was confession for me.
Speaker 1:You know, it's interesting, mo, how sometimes these things, these conversations, circle back on themselves, because where we started is we ended up. In this place, talking about obedience and confession is really about saying, if I'm not feeling God, is it because I'm trying to do life on my own and in sort of confessing God, I need you, and that in that confession it starts to get us back aligned with what God is wanting to say.
Speaker 2:Yeah, or even I need you to show me what it is I really believe about you or what I really believe about myself. You know, god revealed to me what I really, what I believe about myself, and you know because so often we live out these unconscious patterns and so God wants to show us. You know the way, very good.
Speaker 1:Yeah Well, we hope this has been helpful for all of you. We didn't give you the ABC here and then you experienced God, but we hopefully lifted up some of the disciplines, but also some of the other practices and just to keep your radar out, because God is present, god is real and are we open to seeing it work, yeah, and I'd love to hear from you some of your spiritual practices that may have worked to connect you with God even more, and so please share those Love to you know.
Speaker 2:Glean some of that wisdom from you guys as well.
Speaker 1:If you're interested in the books that I mentioned, one was Celebration of Discipline by Richard J Foster and the other one the Spirit of the Disciplines, by Dallas Willard.
Speaker 2:Next time on Unpacking Truths, the story of God, holistically, like looking at the whole story and how all peoples and all nations are to be brought to God in a loving relationship. And God speaks about. The sun shines on those you know who are evil as well as good. I, you know, I water, you know I provide right abundantly. I love all my children and all I want you to do is love right, love of me, love of self, so that you can love others well. And so if that's what we default on, that's our big number one thing to default on. I don't think we have the right to cast out or divide or separate. That is very contrary to who we are as believers in Jesus as our savior. Thanks for joining us on this episode of Unpacking Truths. If anything that we discussed sparked any ideas or you have any questions, we would love for you to go to unpackingtruthscom or you can also email us at unpackingtruths at locchurchcom.
Speaker 1:And don't forget to like, share or subscribe to the podcast, because you doing that allows other people to connect to this content and grow with God as well.
Speaker 2:Until next time, we hope you know that you are loved.
